Speaker dilemma

[Analog103]

Ok here we go again ...

Let me share a brief history ...

I bought my SE4122 loaded with Celestion G12H30 (75hz) speakers for a good price. I was never really satisfied with the speakers as I thought I could make my '74 DR103 sound better, fuller.
I then bought a quad of 122190 Sound City Fane speakers on ebay, and apparently these sound very close to the Hiwatt Fanes. They have an alu dust cap, though. 1 of them got completely ripped during transport and 1 had a small hole in the cone. I repaired this one a additionally bought a 122231 Hiwatt Fane (which I luckily found on ebay at the same time). The guy who repaired the SC Fane is apparently a pro, but I can hear the speaker farting out sometimes when playing LOUD.

Now, I don't know if it's the "repaired" speaker, the mismatched quad, but when I play my amp LOUD I can hear a shrillness to the sound. I mean, it still sounds fat and full, but the highs just have this unpleasant buzz to them. Do you think it's the alu dust caps?

I'm kinda tired of looking for separate Hiwatt Fanes to complete the cab, so I'd like to hear your opinion about the alternatives to settle this once and for all.

First of all, is this high end buzz normal (I think NOT, but how the hell should I know, I never played through a proper Fane loaded cab)? I can't hear it on cabs with V30's, for example. Are the speakers just "tired"?

What would be the best to do? To get a quad of Thames, the new Lynch speakers or even Tonkers or something else? To wait for a proper Hiwatt Fane loaded cab (wish me luck)? Order a Reeves cab? ...

Help me please!

[OldSchoolDave]

Don't give up just yet!

Aluminum dust caps can develop hairline cracks that "chirp" at certain frequencies. Is that what you're hearing? FWIW, the smaller diameter ones, as found on Fanes and Altecs, seem more susceptible. The large JBL-type domes aren't as likely to crack.

I also have a quad of SC Fanes with the aluminum dust caps and they creaked (upon cone flex) and chirped. They also had a buildup of gunk in the voicecoil gap, causing scratchiness, which Dr.Hiwatt was good enough to resolve (and document).

If I were you, I'd carefully remove as much of those dust caps as possible. Replace them with large, open mesh cloth dust caps and re-test. You could even test them without dust caps, provided you were in a relatively clean environment.

As to the other speakers: Small holes in cones can be repaired with silicone or rubber cement (used sparingly). Does the person who "repaired" the ripped one guarantee his work? If so, have him verify that speaker is working as designed. Did he install a new cone or patch the original one?

Dave

[Analog103]

Hi Dave

He patched the old cone. I don't think it would be a good idea that I remove the caps myself.

The problem is I never heard that buzz or whatever it is on any recorded stuff and I listened to a lot of samples. I want a clear, strong sound, that's all.

[OldSchoolDave]

I want a clear, strong sound, that's all.

And that is what you SHOULD get!

Vintage speakers can have issues. Most are worth some attention (especially Fanes).

Can you post pictures of the cone repair? Just curious.

Dave

[Analog103]

The speakers are in my cab right now and I didn't take pictures, unfortunately.

What do you think is my best option?

[OldSchoolDave]

What do you think is my best option?

Take 'em out! They're not performing as they should or as you desire. Leaving them as-is isn't much of a choice.

Do you have anyone local to you who would feel comfortable performing the operation detailed in this thread?:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=22&start=0&st=0&sk=t&sd=a

If not, selling them as wounded speakers and getting a quad of modern clones would be the fastest route.

Dave

[mikhailwatt]

The problem is I never heard that buzz or whatever it is on any recorded stuff and I listened to a lot of samples.

Any chance it could be the grille cloth vibrating against a close mic? You wouldn't hear that in the room, but it could be audible on the recording.

[Analog103]

No, I hear it when I play.

I'm sure it must be that one speaker though. I remember when I got the speakers I "tested" them in a Marshall valvestate combo (I know, I know ... ) and the Hiwatt Fane and the two SC Fanes were working fine and the one with the hole in the cone sounded horrible (it was before the repair).

I just don't know if it's worth it for me to wait for old speakers import them and pay a lot on shipping and then getting holes in the cones or "tired" speakers or whatever. I heard a lot of compliments about Reeves cabs and the VP speakers, but I'd love to keep my SE4122 and don't really need two cabs. Webers are an option too, both Thames and FC12's, though for rock'n'roll I think Thames would be better suited.

Do these (VP, Weber ...) handle an occasional bass aswell?

[Analog103]

I just played the halfstack again. I think it's just this one speaker causing trouble. I won't bother with it, the cone had a hole, it will never be the same again. I'll look for a single Fane (preferably a Hiwatt Fane 122231) and then replace the damaged speaker.

As for the alu dust covers ... can they be replaced with cloth? Would that be a benefit or should I just leave the SC Fanes the way they are?

[OldSchoolDave]

As for the alu dust covers ... can they be replaced with cloth? Would that be a benefit or should I just leave the SC Fanes the way they are?

If you aren't hearing any chirps or creaks, leave them alone.

If you are, there's no harm in replacing them with cloth domes. That could cut down on any high frequency "beaming" you might hear.

Dave

[Analog103]

Well, well, well ... my speaker dilemma seems to be over, finally! Today (3) Hiwatt Fane 122231 speakers from '72 arrived, well packed, not damaged. I had one 122231 before, that one is from '73. My cab is '72 or '73 so it looks like I have a nice "matched" set now. But that's not important. I connected the speakers and ... OH YEAH! Perfect!

Compared to the SC Fanes, there certainly is something different to these speakers. You guys say they're "woody" sounding? I'd say so, yeah.

I spent my last bucks on them and well ... this is it, no more bullshit!

[Dr.HI-TONE]

Great news!

[OldSchoolDave]

Mission Accomplished - congrats!

Dave

[mhuss]

"There ain't nothin' like the real thing, baby..."

Good news.

--mark