Hylight Hiwatt Fanes VS Sound City Fanes

[Dr.HI-TONE]

I have seen those codes too. I just can't remember all of them off the top of my head........I really should keep a journal!

You should get LAL tones with a CP103 and SG special.
And Volume!

If it were close to me, I would buy it!

[shakti]

'68 SG Special: check
CP103: ...TBB (to be built)
SC 4x12:...maybe...keep your eyes peeled....

[Dr.HI-TONE]

Awesome!

[OldSchoolDave]

I would have to ssume these are original cones, but what does that make of these speakers?

Agreed.

Are you able to play through the cab before purchase? If the speakers are functioning properly, it would be a very desirable cab. Those models seem to be susceptible to voice coil rub over time. At the very least, have the seller record some clips at a loud, clean setting so you can hear if there's any fizz.

Dave

[shakti]

Seller says everything is A OK. I'm almost there now...

I found this photo of a supposedly original Hiwatt cab, which looks identical except for the grille cloth. Same location of the piping channels and all. Does this look like a stock Hiwatt cab? Never seen that placement of the piping channels before on a Hiwatt cab, but those early ones were probably "experimental"...note the thinner edge on the front, which is similar to the late 60 Sound City cabs:


Full size image here:
http://www.hsronline.biz/HSR%20gear%20p ... BGS003.JPG

I thought maybe I'd dress it up as a Hiwatt cab...the grille cloth and logo will be save for the future, of course.

[Dr.HI-TONE]

the newly posted picture of a cab is not a real HIWATT.
Someone has put new grillecloth on some older cab, perhaps a Sound City.

[shakti]

That's what I thought...all the Hiwatt-labeled cabs I've seen have had the piping channels closer to the edges. But am I right in thinking that the early ones were otherwise identical to SC cabs, i.e. the thinner front edges? Looks like around 1970-71 they settled into the "classic" Hiwatt look with the thicker but much more rounded edges.

[shakti]

OK, the deal is clinched! Price was fair...not a bargain, but not bad at all considering the rarity of these things, plus it looks to be in quite good condition. In the photo it looks like the tolex is shot, but I think it's just the blurring effect used that makes it appear like that.

[shakti]

As I've mentioned in my other threads on my CP103 build and elsewhere, I've been using this cab a lot lately with a new CP103 build. It does sound great, but there are some minor issues with regards to the back panel (ported or closed back) etc. The speakers are a little fizzy sounding, not sure if they're even broken in very much!

I did notice one thing though; they appear to have no doping of the surrounds. Is this the norm for Hiwatt Fanes? I saw one photo in another thread where the speakers were very clearly doped, but that was a front loaded cab, so a much later cab. What about the early 50W Fane loaded Hiwatt cabs (i.e. late 60s/early 70s) - were the speakers doped or not?

[Dr.HI-TONE]

all Hylight Fanes were doped.

[shakti]

Interesting. This might be the one crucial difference between SC and Hiwatt Fanes, then. Got any photos of the doping, particularly on early models?

I'm not sure what doping would do, but I would expect them to be less fizzy and crackly. I have some Cerwin-Vega ER123 speakers which are not doped, and they have some of the same sizzle and crunch as these Fanes. The ER123s sound terrific and have some amazing overtones, like these Fanes, but on their own they can be a little grating on the ears, so I like to mix them up with smoother-sounding Celestions.

[OldSchoolDave]

I'm not sure what doping would do, ...

Doping serves to reinforce the speaker surround and reduce over-excursion, which can lead to unpleasant sounds (farting, ghost notes, etc.). Too much can deaden a speaker, which is why some models aren't doped.

Dave

[shakti]

Yes, from a technical viewpoint I understand what it does...what's uncertain is how adding doping would make the speakers sound in this particular case? I don't like to futz too much with things though.

The speakers don't have any cone cry/ghosting at all, but they do fart a bit and there's too much sizzle---almost like there's "too much" going on compared to what I would like. They seem to break up into a *lot* of overtones which is a desirable and interesting effect in some cases, but can also be a little annoying and grating in other cases.

[mikhailwatt]

all Hylight Fanes were doped.

...but they don't look like it, AFAIK. Not like you usually see, with that obvious shiny ring of dope on the surround.

FWIW - I had a discussion with Ted Weber (RIP) about this, and he suggested that the old Fanes had some sort of dampening agent mixed in with the cone pulp.

[shakti]

I've seen 70s Hiwatt Fanes where the doping is quite evident and looks like the doping on any other speaker. But it would be interesting to find out if Hiwatt Fanes are different from SC Fanes in this department. Particularly the earliest ('68-'71) Hiwatt cabs/speakers.